Lawyers Expect The Big East And West Virginia To Settle
by Mengus22 on Jan 20, 2012 10:51 AM EST
in The Big East Falls Apart
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PrintThe Charleston Gazette's Mitch Vingle spoke with West Virginia Athletic Director Oliver Luck yesterday about the school's pending move to the Big 12 and the legal wrangling surrounding it. Since Luck is unable to publicly comment on it any further, Vingle presented the competing lawsuits to three attorneys and the consensus was that the Big East and West Virginia will have to find a way to settle the lawsuits. Vingle writes:
Local attorney Rusty Webb calls the case "unprecedented" in regard to dueling jurisdiction and questionable enforcement power. Another, who spoke for background, said if a ruling was made against WVU in Rhode Island, an appeal would be forthcoming from the school. That would take up to a year or two to resolve.
So all signs point to WVU jumping to the Big 12 next school year and paying damages. What's odd is neither the Big East nor the Big 12 seem to be covering their respective behinds in regard to scheduling.
That means either a compromise is being hammered out now or one set of schools, likely the Big East, will be left with 11-game football schedules.
WVU must join the Big 12 to have its full slate of games. When TCU jumped to the Big East and then to the Big 12, it left a hole in the Mountaineer schedule.
According to Vingle, even if an injunction is issued for the Big East and West Virginia is ordered to stay, the Mountaineers would still make the jump to the Big 12 because of the court's inability to enforce its injunction. Still, that doesn't mean West Virginia is unmotivated to settle. Vingle writes:
On the other hand, WVU is highly motivated to settle/compromise because it needs to join the Big 12 and make that league's TV contract whole. Both WVU and the Big 12 might be working on a compromise. (Big 12 commissioner Chuck Neinas wasn't immediately available for comment.) Why? Because there's a chance the Big East could amend its complaint and add the Big 12 to the breach of contract suit.
That's the last thing West Virginia would want. Morgantown is already gaining a reputation across the nation's university landscape as Litigation City. It doesn't want to add to that and drag its new partners into a legal battle.
So it's in the best interest of all to compromise, reach an agreement and get those schedules released. Tickets need to be sold. The wound needs to be cauterized.
Obviously nothing will be settled in the very near future, but this is something worth paying attention to as the Big East would likely be left scrambling to fill its schedule for the 2012 season with an early departure by West Virginia.
For more coverage West Virginia's attempt to leave the Big East early, stay tuned to our Big East Falls Apart section.
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If WVU jumps to the B12 next season that leaves the Big East with only 7 members
Doesn’t one of the by-laws for AQ status state that the minimum conference membership in football is eight members? So, as part of the deal the Big East has to either be getting that waived for next season or muscling one of the new schools into joining early (by paying large sums of money to CUSA or the MWC).
Go Bulls!
No
there are no specific guidelines for AQ.
But to maintain FBS status, I believe, the minimum is 7 schools.
"that place laid the foundation for who I am. A lot of outsiders make fun of it and say negative things about West Virginia. Fuck them" - Jerry West
by MountaineerAirman on Jan 20, 2012 11:25 AM EST up reply actions
IIRC, it's 8, but you can get a waiver
and in circumstances like this, it’s almost always granted. The WAC would cease to exist as an FBS conference without a waiver; it will only have 7 schools for football next season.
My point is still valid
The Big East is not a football conference in 2012 without WVU, unless they add another team in early
Go Bulls!
by Leavitt Town on Jan 20, 2012 12:11 PM EST up reply actions
They can (and almost certainly will) get a waiver from the NCAA to play football with 7 schools
Which is what it’s got for 2012 without WVU, unless SU & Pitt leave early too (and neither they nor the ACC are all that interested). So not a problem.
For 2013, the Big East either has 12 (with SU & Pitt) or 10 (without them) football teams, at least until the next move into or out of the Big East is announced.
Will someone who is smarter than me explain what the implication for SU and Pitt is?
As a result of a settlement, would there be precedent for SU and Pitt to pay the BE the same amount of money WVU ends up shilling out (assuming that SU and Pitt wanted to)?
"That's no moon..."
"Now you will wittness the fire-power of this fully armed and operational Death Orange..."
Probably, but
the difference is that the Big 12 NEEDS West Virginia immediately, whereas the ACC is more than happy to wait on Pitt and ’Cuse.
Honestly, this is just my opinion, but more than likely the ACC is probably regretting the ’Cuse and Pitt move a little bit. It seems like very much a reactionary move to the SEC expanding. However, I do think Pitt and ’Cuse were solid additions for the ACC in terms of fan support and legacy, and obviously great additions in basketball (even if Pitt is stinking it up right now.)
But regardless, the ACC doesn’t NEED Pitt and ’Cuse whereas the Big XII needs WVU to avoid schedule nightmares.
"that place laid the foundation for who I am. A lot of outsiders make fun of it and say negative things about West Virginia. Fuck them" - Jerry West
by MountaineerAirman on Jan 20, 2012 11:28 AM EST up reply actions
What SU & Pitt probably want to do
is to pay a smaller buyout than WVU pays, and join the ACC for the 2013 season (rather than the schedule ‘just working out that way’ with both of us playing @Boise and @SDSU — the latter of which would be nice for me, but not many other Orange fans, I think).
Very good point.
I agree with that. If Pitt and ‘Cuse don’t NEED out, I’m sure they’re not gonna wanna pay the huge buyout.
"that place laid the foundation for who I am. A lot of outsiders make fun of it and say negative things about West Virginia. Fuck them" - Jerry West
by MountaineerAirman on Jan 21, 2012 8:13 AM EST up reply actions
They wouldn't be dicks and leave for 2012
I don’t think the ACC is planning for their immediate arrival anyway.
2013 would be in play, but I doubt they try to leave immediately.
Okay, somebody in the Big East has made this necessary. "BC" in my nickname references the icon. I AM NOT A BOSTON COLLEGE FAN.
Why doesn't the Big East add temple for 2012?
This would satisfy the need for 8 football schools and help the basketball schedules.
There's an escape clause for the MAC which allows them to drop UMass if Temple leaves
and Temple would owe the MAC a $2.5 million buyout
by Patrick_the_Ruminator on Jan 20, 2012 12:29 PM EST up reply actions
This is ugly for WVU...
There is a reason the chatter and rhetoric has stopped from WVU officials. I’m sure West Virginia counsel from the State has told them to zip it. Mentions by WVU officials of being in the Big 12 in 2012 and included in their schedule only adds fuel to fire against them. If the court process goes full term, they’ll be stuck in the Big East battling through 2013-14 season with appeals and etc. If the Big 12 released a schedule with WVU included prior to a court action, they could face an injunction from said court and would find themselves a defendant as a conspirator. If WVU just bolts, the damages will be extensive and the Big 12 would again be drawn into the legal fray owing the Big East damages! The last thing a conference with its own member issues wants to deal with is potentially owing tens of millions in court ordered damages to another conference and making its own members more uneasy.
If WVU wants to safely exit early without pulling the Big 12 into the battle and risk alienating itself, the Big East and WVU must settle and it will be costly to the Mountaineers. Just consider the buyouts of other AQ-conferences are $20-million or more and that is without litigation, and usually not in the spring of the year you want to leave. Plus the Big East has a two year exit plan, not a one year out like the others. Add to that, WVU voted in favor of increasing the Big East exit fees in the future to a $10-million payment, forfeiture of television revenue, and a 27-month wait. Under that bylaw, schools looking to leave in the future would be on the hook for $24-million (fee & tv share) and still have to wait 27-months. A court mediated settlement would likely be far more, considering the rescheduling aspect, loss of potential bowl or BCS winnings, the Big East not meeting its own television obligations, and more importantly the Big East having to seek to be included as a NCAA FBS conference (as they’d be less than 8-teams) under a temporary clause. I’ve been saying WVU would be on the hook $30-50 in a settlement or damages since they filed back around Halloween. Had they not sued, they probably could have reached some buyout around $20-million that would have paid the conference and made them responsible for the buyout of say Boise State to replace them in the Big East. It would have been stiff enough to keep SU & Pitt from paying and bolting and maintained the Conference size and with a BCS ranking darling, but they sued, and now it will get costly, cause their hope that the Big East would back-down, didn’t work.
I like sports, movies, and music!
a tale of two lawsuits in two states
good analysis but you left out some significant elements. there are two trials happening and many of the legal pundits I’ve been reading think the one in Providence does not have jurisdiction since WVU is an agent of the state of West Virginia. Rhode Island courts cannot order the state of West Virginia to pay damages and if so would have no way to enforce such a ruling. The key of course is to make “state agency” stick. If it does stick, then damages will be decided and enforced by the court in West Virginia which would in all likelihood significantly less than an RI ruling. WVU holds this card at the mediation table now, plus the card that the BE did nothing to keep TCU and because of this and other similar issues (like not actively recruiting new football members prior to Pit, SU botling) , the BE failed to hold up their end of the contract that WVU signed. But state agency is the biggest issue. IF WVU is found an agent of the state, the RI courts can bark as loud as they want, but they have no teeth.
no movement without the lawsuit
one piece I disagree with is that the BE would have settled with WVU if they had not brought the suit. there was and is no evidence that the BE would have moved in a timely fashion to grant the wishes of WVU, the only hardball answer is “27 months.” i maintain the lawsuit was necessary to get a settlement to happen.
Agreed
I sincerely believe that was the sole and entire purpose of the lawsuit to begin with. Oliver Luck is not stupid, and neither are the scores of lawyers he has hired.
"that place laid the foundation for who I am. A lot of outsiders make fun of it and say negative things about West Virginia. Fuck them" - Jerry West
by MountaineerAirman on Jan 22, 2012 7:14 PM EST up reply actions
The Big XII needs to step in here
Either they need to tell WVU to go to Hell and not drag them into this mess, or they need to jump into this mess on their behalf.
Okay, somebody in the Big East has made this necessary. "BC" in my nickname references the icon. I AM NOT A BOSTON COLLEGE FAN.
Laughable
B12 is not going to get involved. They need WVU in the B12, but they don’t need to encore liability on behalf of WVU. They can state they thought WVU was in the clear to join and wont join until they are.
Go Bulls!
by Leavitt Town on Jan 20, 2012 3:48 PM EST up reply actions
I'm sure
the Big 12 has lawyers working with WVU’s lawyers, no doubt, but like Leavitt Town said, they’re not going to get directly involved. They don’t want to be pulled into the lawsuit as well.
They’re probably going to go along with the idea that if the courts rule against WVU, WVU will appeal, which will take a long time, and leave anyway. It’s a giant mess.
I’m not one of these fans who think WVU owns the Big East, blah blah. I don’t like the lawsuit, but I unfortunately, think it was necessary. It’s up for debate on whether the Big XII is better for WVU than the Big East (I think it is) and people have different opinions, but the fact is they wanted WVU, WVU wanted out, and they absolutely need WVU immediately.
"that place laid the foundation for who I am. A lot of outsiders make fun of it and say negative things about West Virginia. Fuck them" - Jerry West
by MountaineerAirman on Jan 21, 2012 8:16 AM EST up reply actions
I don't think there's any debate
Any Big East school that got an invite to another AQ conference would take it, and every school that’s left for football (except possibly the some of the schools slated to join in 2013) is actively seeking a better conference. Most are not even being all that coy about denying it.
UConn
wasn’t denying it at all, and Rutgers wasn’t exactly hiding it. UConn wants the ACC. Bad. Rutgers wants them all and is rumored for them all except the SEC and Pac-12. (rumored ACC, Big 10, Big 12.) Louisville fought tooth and nail to get to the Big XII over WVU, and they’re likely joining when they do go to 12.Cincy is a rumored candidate as well.
That leaves USF for schools that haven’t had any substantial rumors about leaving… (though they was a short-lived rumor that the Big XII may look into them. I don’t see that happening ever.)
"that place laid the foundation for who I am. A lot of outsiders make fun of it and say negative things about West Virginia. Fuck them" - Jerry West
by MountaineerAirman on Jan 21, 2012 1:03 PM EST up reply actions
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